[Troggy]

Originally Posted by Jefferson Rank

Yeah, I was just looking for more options. Good to have you back though.

Thanks :D

Originally Posted by ZakMcD

Swords Dance, Return.
Dead.

Scizor isnt fighting type so i dont think it would kill me in one or even two hits.
Also Lucario has pretty average defense and evn though its steel i still reckon Absol would in.

Good hypothetical battle on my behalf

I don't think you understand how Pokemon works, so I'll help you out with some examples.

Scenario 1:

Absol switches in against something that doesn't threaten it. End of Turn 1.

Absol uses Swords Dance, opponent switches to Scizor. End of Turn 2.

Next turn, Scizor uses Bullet Punch, which OHKOs Absol provided 1) Stealth Rock is in play (likely) and 2) Scizor is holding a Choice Band (also very likely). Without Stealth Rock, there is still a chance Absol will be OHKO'd (Damage is ~89-106%). Even if you manage to get an attack off, you would die to Life Orb Recoil if that is your held item. The only way you could damage Scizor before it kills you is with Sucker Punch, but Scizor resists it and will never be OHKO'd.

Scenario 2:

Absol switches in safely against something. End of Turn 1.

Absol uses Swords Dance, opponent switches to Lucario. End of Turn 2.

Lucario uses Close Combat, which obviously OHKOs Absol. Lucario has a 4x Resist to Sucker Punch, and Absol is always slower than Lucario when it is using a Swords Dance set. This one isn't even debatable.

Now, both of these scenarios assume that the user of Absol attempts to set up a Swords Dance, as you mentioned. A more proactive player might have tried to hit these counters on the switch by using an appropriate attacking move. This relies a lot on prediction, since when Absol comes out you are not likely to know what their counter is. In this case, using Superpower or Fire Blast (Although I'll admit the mixed set is more or less novelty or for UU battles) instead of Swords Dance may net you some good damage on their switch in. That said, Absol is not going to come out on top against Scizor or Lucario without either extremely good prediction, or a Choice Scarf.

[CheckeredFloors]

Originally Posted by Troggy

Thanks :D



I don't think you understand how Pokemon works, so I'll help you out with some examples.

Scenario 1:

Absol switches in against something that doesn't threaten it. End of Turn 1.

Absol uses Swords Dance, opponent switches to Scizor. End of Turn 2.

Next turn, Scizor uses Bullet Punch, which OHKOs Absol provided 1) Stealth Rock is in play (likely) and 2) Scizor is holding a Choice Band (also very likely). Without Stealth Rock, there is still a chance Absol will be OHKO'd (Damage is ~89-106%). Even if you manage to get an attack off, you would die to Life Orb Recoil if that is your held item. The only way you could damage Scizor before it kills you is with Sucker Punch, but Scizor resists it and will never be OHKO'd.

Scenario 2:

Absol switches in safely against something. End of Turn 1.

Absol uses Swords Dance, opponent switches to Lucario. End of Turn 2.

Lucario uses Close Combat, which obviously OHKOs Absol. Lucario has a 4x Resist to Sucker Punch, and Absol is always slower than Lucario when it is using a Swords Dance set. This one isn't even debatable.

Now, both of these scenarios assume that the user of Absol attempts to set up a Swords Dance, as you mentioned. A more proactive player might have tried to hit these counters on the switch by using an appropriate attacking move. This relies a lot on prediction, since when Absol comes out you are not likely to know what their counter is. In this case, using Superpower or Fire Blast (Although I'll admit the mixed set is more or less novelty or for UU battles) instead of Swords Dance may net you some good damage on their switch in. That said, Absol is not going to come out on top against Scizor or Lucario without either extremely good prediction, or a Choice Scarf.

...or i teach absol either fire blast or flamethrower.
X4 damage on a scizor and a times 2 damage on a lucario.
Likely one hit death for scizor, absol being faster than it won't take a hit.
I concede on the Lucario one though.

[raychull]

Originally Posted by Troggy

Alright, sounds good. You don't have to call me bro, by the way. I'm not much of one ;|



Yes that'd also do it. When Scizor and Lucario* laugh at you it's kind of hard to be useful in OU.

*Can't switch into Superpower, but meh still gonna get the best of Absol most of the time

hahaha, i'm sorry. it's become almost a habit of mine to call people bro.
what's your current lineup?

[Troggy]

Originally Posted by ZakMcD

...or i teach absol either fire blast or flamethrower.
X4 damage on a scizor and a times 2 damage on a lucario.
Likely one hit death for scizor, absol being faster than it won't take a hit.
I concede on the Lucario one though.

Yes I believe I already said that. However, you wouldn't know what they are switching into Absol, so it would really be luck. They could bring in Heatran instead, who also can kill Absol and absorbs Fire attacks. So like I said before, the only way Absol can have a chance against either is with very good prediction and already knowing your opponent has one or both of those on their team. Generally you would just be switching Absol out when you see one of these Steel types come in.

Even though Absol is faster than Scizor, Scizor still has a priority move. So essentially Absol should be considered slower unless it is using Sucker Punch, since Bullet Punch does massive damage to Absol.

That's probably enough discussion. Absol is a good Pokemon, and dangerous in the right hands, but it has plenty of counters so it is unrealistic to ever say 'nothing beats it'.

Originally Posted by raychull

hahaha, i'm sorry. it's become almost a habit of mine to call people bro.
what's your current lineup?

Umm, what do you mean? I have a few I suppose. I have my old OU team on my DS, I have an old Shoddy team that I could finish on my DS if I wanted (have all the Pokes, they're not all trained), I have a current Shoddy team (Only have 1-2 on DS so far), and I have my future HG/SS team that is 5/6 made on DS :p

[Jefferson Rank]

I'm going to start trying to get emerald working again. I seem to have lost colluseum's memory card, so I'm already out some beastly Pickup people and an EV trained Rayquaza, so I need to build up again.

[SomedayTheFire]

http://www.gossipgamers.com/pokemon-...style-artwork/

Some pretty epic pokemon traditional Japanese re designs.

[donwagenblast]

Originally Posted by SomedayTheFire

http://www.gossipgamers.com/pokemon-...style-artwork/

Some pretty epic pokemon traditional Japanese re designs.

Those are really cool.

[Jefferson Rank]

Originally Posted by SomedayTheFire

http://www.gossipgamers.com/pokemon-...style-artwork/

Some pretty epic pokemon traditional Japanese re designs.

Scariest Jigglypuff ever.

[donwagenblast]

Originally Posted by Jefferson Rank

Scariest Jigglypuff ever.

I was thinking that as well.

[Never Better]

COME ON NORTH AMERICA

x

[Troggy]

Originally Posted by Jefferson Rank

I'm going to start trying to get emerald working again. I seem to have lost colluseum's memory card, so I'm already out some beastly Pickup people and an EV trained Rayquaza, so I need to build up again.

Ooooh that stinks. Maybe you'll find it though. Were you having trouble with your Emerald or just haven't been on it in a while? I'm tempted to restart so I can catch better Regis, but I already have it all set up for cloning and what not so :/

[donwagenblast]

HeartGold and SoulSilver will be impacting North America March 12, 2010.

[Jefferson Rank]

Originally Posted by donwagenblast

HeartGold and SoulSilver will be impacting North America March 12, 2010.

Nice avatar. I think I'll do the same with some other pokemon.

Originally Posted by Troggy

Ooooh that stinks. Maybe you'll find it though. Were you having trouble with your Emerald or just haven't been on it in a while? I'm tempted to restart so I can catch better Regis, but I already have it all set up for cloning and what not so :/

Emerald's fine, I'm just done with it. Only use it to train things. I'm more likely going to train up some things on platinum.

[FueledByFrodo]

Jirachi event soon?

[donwagenblast]

Originally Posted by FueledByFrodo

Jirachi event soon?

I haven't heard anything. I know the Pickachu-colored Pichu event is coming up, though.