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10:33 AM on 05/13/14 
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Star Slight
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Exactly, it's moreso about the clarification than me trying to make it a "thing". It should be a thing because the comments and actions by the booking companies in LI and that specific tour manager were wrong.
11:01 AM on 05/13/14 
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The_Effort
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Also, by telling fans to burn their merch, and using connections to stop this band from booking certain places, isn't this tour manger guy essentially using his status to bully this young and less-successful band? That doesn't sit well with me. It seems so against every message TWY has always tried to convey.

I know he isn't in the band, so the band isn't necessarily bullying anybody or whatever, but am I wrong to say that his actions as tour manager/merch guy are representative of the band to the fans at the show at that time? Has that been addressed anywhere? Why would it be okay for him to use your fans and your merch table as a means to continue to bully this smaller band because maybe some guy he knows made a huge mistake and he doesn't wanna own up to it?

The whole thing just doesn't sit well with me.
12:23 PM on 05/13/14 
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nicksteinborn
The Wonder Years / Nick
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Hatfield, PA
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He's not selling our merchandise anymore and hasn't been for a couple years. He was having a bad day and made an inappropriate comment. It happened and that's it.

No single member of my band can represent everyone and someone we hire to make sure our tours run smoothly certainly does not speak for our band.
12:26 PM on 05/13/14 
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Sakarazu
Just a little nervous from the fall
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Boston
Male - 18 Years Old
It's not that he is actually representing the entire band's opinions it's just that when you are paying someone to do a job while they are doing so they represent the organization that is paying them. I would not be able to tell someone to fuck off while at work or while wearing my work uniform for the same reason, even though anyone that isn't an idiot could probably figure out that the company I work for doesn't want them to fuck off.
12:33 PM on 05/13/14 
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Ryan Dennehy
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Pretty sure nick just said that he hasn't worked for them for a few years.
12:40 PM on 05/13/14 
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MattRM
She didn't turn out to be that cool
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Pretty sure nick just said that he hasn't worked for them for a few years.
Said he hasn't sold merch for a few years. He's still their tour manager and he's on every tour with them.

As a huge fan of both TWY and The Hotelier, and also as a huge fan of common decency, and of rape accusations being taken seriously, I really don't see what's so hard about JJR or Nick just saying, "Hey, I'm sorry. That was inappropriate. Rape accusations are serious, and someone within our band family made a comment that belittled that fact. It shouldn't have happened, but all parties accountable take responsibility for it, and it won't happen again. We extend our support to the victim."

"It happened and that's it" is not an appropriate response.
12:42 PM on 05/13/14 
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nicksteinborn
The Wonder Years / Nick
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Pretty sure nick just said that he hasn't worked for them for a few years.

No. Just clarifying that he does not sell our merch. He is our tour manager. People seemed concerned that he was scolding kids at the merch table or something.
12:47 PM on 05/13/14 
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Star Slight
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Said he hasn't sold merch for a few years. He's still their tour manager and he's on every tour with them.

As a huge fan of both TWY and The Hotelier, and also as a huge fan of common decency, and of rape accusations being taken seriously, I really don't see what's so hard about JJR or Nick just saying, "Hey, I'm sorry. That was inappropriate. Rape accusations are serious, and someone within our band family made a comment that belittled that fact. It shouldn't have happened, but all parties accountable take responsibility for it, and it won't happen again. We extend our support to the victim."

"It happened and that's it" is not an appropriate response.

yeah, pretty much
12:53 PM on 05/13/14 
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codeseven
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First I've heard of any of this. But "It happened and that's it" is a terrible way of looking at it.
12:54 PM on 05/13/14 
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nicksteinborn
The Wonder Years / Nick
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Hatfield, PA
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Said he hasn't sold merch for a few years. He's still their tour manager and he's on every tour with them.

As a huge fan of both TWY and The Hotelier, and also as a huge fan of common decency, and of rape accusations being taken seriously, I really don't see what's so hard about JJR or Nick just saying, "Hey, I'm sorry. That was inappropriate. Rape accusations are serious, and someone within our band family made a comment that belittled that fact. It shouldn't have happened, but all parties accountable take responsibility for it, and it won't happen again. We extend our support to the victim."

"It happened and that's it" is not an appropriate response.

Sorry, dude. I don't owe you or anyone an apology for something I couldn't have been less involved in. I sincerely wish that John had bit his tongue instead of making that comment, but I am not John and I was not there.
12:58 PM on 05/13/14 
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Sakarazu
Just a little nervous from the fall
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Boston
Male - 18 Years Old
You could've been less involved if, say, it didn't happen at your show by someone you employ
01:03 PM on 05/13/14 
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Star Slight
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No one owes anyone anything, it's just kinda part of that common courtesy thing when someone says something offensive regarding a person defending a potential rape victim
01:09 PM on 05/13/14 
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MattRM
She didn't turn out to be that cool
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Oxford, OH
Male - 23 Years Old
Sorry, dude. I don't owe you or anyone an apology for something I couldn't have been less involved in. I sincerely wish that John had bit his tongue instead of making that comment, but I am not John and I was not there.
Do you really not understand the way that you and everyone else in the band is implicitly involved, though? I get that none of you have any control over what John says. I get that nothing that John says officially represents the band's stance on anything, I know he's not a spokesperson. But you're bringing a guy out on tour with you who, regardless of how bad of a day he was having, regardless of how it has been taken out of context, regardless of the fact that his exact tone probably can't be replicated on the internet, told a fan of your band to burn his shirt - the underlying reason being, someone in that band took a stand for something that he believes to be important, and that involves the issue of rape.

I know John isn't your merch guy and he isn't selling merch to kids and making these comments left and right, but the position in which you've employed him without a doubt has him interacting with fans every night. When I came to your VIP acoustic set, he was the first person from your band or your crew who I spoke with, because he was stationed at the front greeting everyone and explaining how the VIP process worked. I know you didn't make the comments yourself, and I know you wish they hadn't been made. But the fact is, you're representing your band and your crew right now. No one else is here, it's just you. And there are a ton of your fans reading what you're saying. I've spent over $200 within the past year on tours, pre-sales, posters, records, etc from your band. I know you don't owe me anything, I know that's not how the band/fan relationship works, but it's not about what's owed - it's about being the bigger person and acknowledging that someone who your band has employed and has positioned to interact with your fans messed up, and no one is taking responsibility. Sure, maybe taking responsibility would mean more people finding out about it, which would mean more uncomfortable conversations about John's position within your crew. But I think that'd be better than continuing to be so dodgy about it. Right now, the situation is still unresolved - but even though you didn't instigate this whole ordeal, it's still within your power to take some steps to try to resolve it, for the sake of your fans who are uncomfortable about it.

I mean all of the above with the utmost respect. I'm not calling for you guys to fire anybody or anything like that. I'm not going to burn my TWY stuff if this doesn't get resolved the way I think it should. I'm just trying to explain how I understand this whole situation.
01:09 PM on 05/13/14 
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nicksteinborn
The Wonder Years / Nick
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Hatfield, PA
Male - 28 Years Old
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You could've been less involved if, say, it didn't happen at your show by someone you employ

Clearly, I'm the bad guy here. I didn't want to respond because I knew that a bunch of people would team up on me for not giving the exact response they wanted.

I don't agree with what he did and I certainly don't condone it. He told me a little after it happened and I said he shouldn't have done that. Nothing has been said or done since and it won't be happening again at our shows.
01:33 PM on 05/13/14 
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Sakarazu
Just a little nervous from the fall
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Boston
Male - 18 Years Old
Clearly, I'm the bad guy here. I didn't want to respond because I knew that a bunch of people would team up on me for not giving the exact response they wanted.

I don't agree with what he did and I certainly don't condone it. He told me a little after it happened and I said he shouldn't have done that. Nothing has been said or done since and it won't be happening again at our shows.
Clearly I called you the bad guy and clearly it is a monumental challenge to say something professional sounding about how you apologize for and do not condone what he said. Because a bunch of people haven't already said things that completely work in that regard. Thank you for doing so now.



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