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01:15 PM on 08/02/12
only the clouds
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Okay before I post, I should include a warning that I'm a music major, so I might come off as a total snob. Sorry.

a) Dubstep isn't about harmonic innovation. It's harmonically atypical, but not complex—we're not used to that kind of harmonic language, but it also doesn't have a whole lot going on.

b) Dubstep frequently uses irregular meter. That's cool, but not genius, because it's a fairly common way to keep your piece interesting. Avante-garde? In pop music, it might seem that way. But I wouldn't call irregular meter innovative. Metal bands, for example, have been doing it for years.

c) Timbre. Dubstep is all about the timbre, or the quality of the tone. The thunky wubs, the screechy squeals—especially when set in the context of the unexpected harmonic language, the contrasts and changes in timbre are what make dubstep exciting. But as the variations in texture are kept entirely within the confines of electronic music, I wouldn't give this the label "avante-garde" either.

That's what I got.
01:20 PM on 08/02/12
Holly HoX!
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I don't think it's true that people don't like something just because it's popular. That's childish. Not you thinking it, but someone actually doing that. Especially in recent years with "Indie" music and styles becoming more mainstream - ie The Black Keys being one of the biggest bands in music, Arcade Fire and Bon Iver winning Grammys etc. I think people generally dislike dubstep - myself included - because a lot of times it's just harsh noise and derivative.

Check out that post too ^
01:20 PM on 08/02/12
rawesome
Listen to Dave Hause pls
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The video dude makes some pretty good points, and in all honesty, he's far more convincing than literally any "Why Dubstep Sucks" arguments I've ever heard. I'm not a fan of the genre, myself, but I can certainly understand why many people would be, and I don't think there's anything wrong with it.

I think this is a neat idea being explored in the video, but unfortunately, I also feel like we first need to address the fact that most people who are so ardently anti-Dubstep are overreacting about the artistic quality and worth of the genre (specifically by saying that it's "not music," or something similar) and that, while they may have valid personal reasons for disliking the genre, that doesn't disqualify it. Until we can get over this overly aggressive disdain for the genre based on pretty much nothing objective or meaningful - though fortunately there's been none of that in this thread as of writing this - then it will be pretty much impossible to have a serious conversation about the merits (or lack thereof) of dubstep.
01:21 PM on 08/02/12
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How many times did you see this image, in fuck emo kid pics?

I really dont see how im being dumb in the slightest... The dude always had a "unique" look. You honestly do not think his shaven head hasnt made him stand out at all? Hes basically the driving force in mainstream popularity of the genre. as always you have to be a piece of shit for no reason

Since you pulled the quote, here you go ^
01:21 PM on 08/02/12
CluckyB
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To be fair, when it comes to music, stuff which is labeled as "Avant Garde" tends to be shit and the more Avant Garde the more shittier it is.

So given dubstep is one of the shittiest forms of music, it seems like it could be a fair comparison.
01:22 PM on 08/02/12
rawesome
Listen to Dave Hause pls
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Okay before I post, I should include a warning that I'm a music major, so I might come off as a total snob. Sorry.

a) Dubstep isn't about harmonic innovation. It's harmonically atypical, but not complex—we're not used to that kind of harmonic language, but it also doesn't have a whole lot going on.

b) Dubstep frequently uses irregular meter. That's cool, but not genius, because it's a fairly common way to keep your piece interesting. Avante-garde? In pop music, it might seem that way. But I wouldn't call irregular meter innovative. Metal bands, for example, have been doing it for years.

c) Timbre. Dubstep is all about the timbre, or the quality of the tone. The thunky wubs, the screechy squeals—especially when set in the context of the unexpected harmonic language, the contrasts and changes in timbre are what make dubstep exciting. But as the variations in texture are kept entirely within the confines of electronic music, I wouldn't give this the label "avante-garde" either.

That's what I got.
I'm curious about this. What does being electronic music-based matter?

EDIT: I would still say the variations are typically pretty substantial and inventive for electronic music, at least from what little I've heard. Especially when compared to far less experimental dance music.
01:25 PM on 08/02/12
xtbs7645x
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No, that's what I found objectionable. I like "popular" music. I don't like shitty music, though.

I don't hate something if it's trendy or popular - I hate it if it sucks. It's the same for most people. There are definitely people that might think differently, but in reality they are saying that to keep some sort of "cred" or they might say they are "guilty pleasures." When it comes to music, I think "guilty pleasures" is the stupidest fucking thing in the world.
Ha, seriously? You came up with all of this from one sentence? My point was, a good majority of people hate on popular things for no justifiable reason. You can agree with me or not, I really dont care. You're taking this way out of context, it has nothing do with popular music automatically being "shitty". I like plenty of "popular" music, for no other reason then I enjoy it.
01:26 PM on 08/02/12
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You want some quality avant-garde electronic music?

Go look up The Caretaker - "An Empty Bliss Beyond This World"
01:27 PM on 08/02/12
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Ha, seriously? You came up with all of this from one sentence? My point was, a good majority of people hate on popular things for no justifiable reason. You can agree with me or not, I really dont care. You're taking this way out of context, it has nothing do with popular music automatically being "shitty". I like plenty of "popular" music, for no other reason then I enjoy it.

I'm discussing. I think it's an interesting point, but a generalization nonetheless. And you're contradicting yourself.
01:34 PM on 08/02/12
xtbs7645x
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I'm discussing. I think it's an interesting point, but a generalization nonetheless. And you're contradicting yourself.
How am I contradicting myself? My opinion is that with anything popular, there are always people who hate on it. Im in no way saying that everyone has this mindset. However, in reality theyre people who do, they judge everything on popularity. I really dont see how you could argue that is not true at all.
01:41 PM on 08/02/12
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How am I contradicting myself? My opinion is that with anything popular, there are always people who hate on it. Im in no way saying that everyone has this mindset. However, in reality theyre people who do, they judge everything on popularity. I really dont see how you could argue that is not true at all.

Right. People also judge music that ten people have heard as well.

Anyway, I don't like dubstep because to me it's just bad, annoying music. It has nothing to do with the "talent" of the musicians either - some of my favorite bands are three chord punk bands. With dubstep it's just random harsh noise to me. It's not something I would listen to on headphones, in the car or recommend to others. Just my opinion anyway. On the other end, I love a lot of grime stuff, diplo, burial, tnght, etc...but then we're not really talking about debstep.
01:45 PM on 08/02/12
Keagan Ilvonen
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To be fair, when it comes to music, stuff which is labeled as "Avant Garde" tends to be shit and the more Avant Garde the more shittier it is.

So given dubstep is one of the shittiest forms of music, it seems like it could be a fair comparison.


That is considered Avant Garde so I disagree with everything you said.
01:52 PM on 08/02/12
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To be fair, when it comes to music, stuff which is labeled as "Avant Garde" tends to be shit and the more Avant Garde the more shittier it is.

Yeah ah okay
01:53 PM on 08/02/12
MyJukeboxBroke
I need a Couch
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well this thread turned into a big ole pissing match
01:53 PM on 08/02/12
Holly HoX!
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Pop punk bubble.
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