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03:40 PM on 07/05/11 
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birdman
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I'll take blaming the victim for 200, Alex.

You obviously aren't capable of having a reasonable conversation.

If name calling is such a horrible problem for you, then you obviously weren't taught any coping mechanisms growing up. I suggest you lighten up or you are going to be miserable for the rest of your life.
03:40 PM on 07/05/11 
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birdman
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I have truly no idea how to respond to that.

Then don't.
03:41 PM on 07/05/11 
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x togepi x
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hahahahahhahahahhahah


so all you racist out there, and to those who aren't-- to make sure you aren't viewed as a racist call a dead black mans widow, it would solidify you as non-racist! Hell, call 2Pac and Biggies moms. Call MJ's mom.

That was the person I was debating with people. An intelligent, well-read, historical scholar, liberal democrat. He makes you guys proud. He put me to shame all right. I'm too embarrassed to say anymore.
THE DEMOCRATS HAVE SPOKEN! I salute ye, and bid you adieu.

are you making all of your posts drunk?
03:52 PM on 07/05/11 
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caveBEAR
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Cops don't harass me because I'm Jewish. They harass me because they can.

So what about the (very real) harassment that young African-American males face from police because they are black?

The fact that you're only being harrassed because 'the cop can' and not because of your skin color pretty much proves everyone's point in here.
03:56 PM on 07/05/11 
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birdman
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So what about the (very real) harassment that young African-American males face from police because they are black?

The fact that you're only being harrassed because 'the cop can' and not because of your skin color pretty much proves everyone's point in here.

What about it? It's deplorable that cops harass anyone who is not doing anything illegal.

But discrimination, harassment, and isolation are not things that are exclusive to blacks. Or any minority for that matter.
04:16 PM on 07/05/11 
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caveBEAR
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What about it? It's deplorable that cops harass anyone who is not doing anything illegal.

But discrimination, harassment, and isolation are not things that are exclusive to blacks. Or any minority for that matter.

True. They do, however, happen in a more institutionalized fashion to some races (such as African-Americans) more frequently than others. Do you agree with that?
04:37 PM on 07/05/11 
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birdman
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True. They do, however, happen in a more institutionalized fashion to some races (such as African-Americans) more frequently than others. Do you agree with that?

I absolutely agree with that. I am not trying to say that real racism isn't alive and well in the US. What I'm saying is that if you look for something hard enough, you'll find it. If you wake up everyone morning knowing that your black and people are going to judge you for that, then you are going to find that judgement whether it is there or not.

There are real, hateful, awful people in this world. Do we really need to put so much effort into lambasting anyone who calls someone a name, or makes an honest observation, or simply feels anxiety with other races? These people aren't hurting anyone.

My original point was that over sensitivity has cause the term "racist" to mean nothing. I still believe that.
04:54 PM on 07/05/11 
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caveBEAR
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I absolutely agree with that. I am not trying to say that real racism isn't alive and well in the US. What I'm saying is that if you look for something hard enough, you'll find it. If you wake up everyone morning knowing that your black and people are going to judge you for that, then you are going to find that judgement whether it is there or not.

There are real, hateful, awful people in this world. Do we really need to put so much effort into lambasting anyone who calls someone a name, or makes an honest observation, or simply feels anxiety with other races? These people aren't hurting anyone.

My original point was that over sensitivity has cause the term "racist" to mean nothing. I still believe that.

So you honestly feel that Love As Arson is simply;
insecure about being black.

You don't feel at all that there is institutionalized racism in this country that can make a person feel persecuted every day just because of their skin color? You honestly believe that they're just 'insecure'?
05:14 PM on 07/05/11 
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JamesBond
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I absolutely agree with that. I am not trying to say that real racism isn't alive and well in the US. What I'm saying is that if you look for something hard enough, you'll find it. If you wake up everyone morning knowing that your black and people are going to judge you for that, then you are going to find that judgement whether it is there or not.

There are real, hateful, awful people in this world. Do we really need to put so much effort into lambasting anyone who calls someone a name, or makes an honest observation, or simply feels anxiety with other races? These people aren't hurting anyone.

My original point was that over sensitivity has cause the term "racist" to mean nothing. I still believe that.

I see that you agree with your opponents that blacks are clearly treated worse than others by cops in America. I also see that no point you make will they ever agree with you on. Even if it's as simple as saying "the republicans have done a lot of good for the country." Even though it's vague as hell, none of them will agree with you there. Instead they will say "no, not compared to what the Democrats have." An argument must always be made. But that's the American way. Republicans started the war right now but are angry The Democrats aren't pulling back the troops. There will always be arguments when it comes to Americans.
I commend you for keeping it civil especially after all the name calling.
05:16 PM on 07/05/11 
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JamesBond
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Oh and he's not an insecure black man. He's an angry black man. Oh how rare.
05:24 PM on 07/05/11 
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loveisdead
LGJ
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Oh and he's not an insecure black man. He's an angry black man. Oh how rare.

yep, i've had enough of you.
05:27 PM on 07/05/11 
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caveBEAR
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Always nice to see someone exit on a low point...
05:41 PM on 07/05/11 
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The Personist
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I won't. I'll let Dom respond himself; that will be more thoughtful than anything I could ever say on the subject anyway. But I can, however, respond to this little dribble of ad hominem nonsense:
You obviously aren't capable of having a reasonable conversation.

If name calling is such a horrible problem for you, then you obviously weren't taught any coping mechanisms growing up. I suggest you lighten up or you are going to be miserable for the rest of your life.

I am perfectly capable of having a reasonable conversation. I have done so time and again, even with people with whom I fundamentally disagree. On these boards, Simulcast comes to mind, since he and I couldn't be more different in our views of capitalism, and yet repeatedly we can converse about it without resorting to cheap jabs and glib remarks; I'd even go so far as to consider him my friend, at least insofar as our AP interactions are concerned. Similarly, I used to get into heated arguments with users about things like religion and yet now some of the people with whom I had the most serious disagreements are some of the users with whom I have the best relationships on here.

The problem is not a matter of coping, it's a matter of grasping the issues at stake, here. Name calling is completely different from the racism we are talking about. When I was in kindergarten, I picked my nose once and someone saw it and for the rest of the year (and it even bled over into first grade, a few people keeping it going as long as fifth or sixth grade) I had a pretty annoying nickname. At first I hated it, someone even made me cry. However, I wouldn't for a second think that my treatment was anywhere near that of someone who has to deal with the fact that people truly believe he is a priori inferior because of the color of his skin.
06:05 PM on 07/05/11 
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Love As Arson
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You are obviously a very intelligent person so when I say this I want to be clear that I am not trying to offend you. It sounds like you are insecure about being black. I say this because people with low self esteem or various insecurities tend to think that people are judging them when they really aren't.
I feel insecure, insofar as I often feel unsafe, wrongly harassed and subject to random acts of oppression. It isn't the perception I have of myself that is the problem, it is the case that I must adjust my behaviour giving the prevailing perception others have of me. That is what you cannot understand and it is precisely because of what I mentioned before. And I do not deny that police often abuse authorities against people that aren't minorities, I do think that the rate at which it occurs is higher for minorities and the encounters are harsher, e.g., I was placed in handcuffs for "walking on a known drug corner" or, as I know, the corner of my street. As for joking back with others, I refuse to do that because it legitimizes the racism of their jokes; it makes it acceptable to joke about lynching or black people getting their rights.
06:06 PM on 07/05/11 
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J.C.
adorkable
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New Haven, CT
ya boy - 28 Years Old
Oh and he's not an insecure black man. He's an angry black man. Oh how rare.

And you just felt the wrath of the angry white man.
 



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