[David87]

Originally Posted by RyanPm40

Ahh, alright, I guess that makes sense. Still sucks ass, but I understand how in this economy, the government reallly shouldn't continue giving us "gifts" of tax breaks anymore. It's just this combined with a lot of other new taxes and costs that's really gonna be rough on my family, stuff adds up haha

The only "new" tax effecting your family is the raise in the payroll tax back to what it was before 2010. Everything else is effecting incomes over 400k.

Obama is solely responsible for the payroll tax cut, BTW. It was not a part of the original Bush Tax Cuts, but something Obama insisted on as a stimulus during the 2010 negotiations to extend the Bush tax cuts for another 2 years.

What most liberals would like to see is the cap on the payroll tax (which stops taxing us after we make 113K or so) removed, so that way everyone's money is taxed for SS and, thus, pretty much ending the problem of funding SS.


As for your "healthcare costs skyrocketing" because of ObamaCare...well that would most likely depend on your personal situation and how you get health insurance, and how much of that insurance you use each year. I would be more than happy to try to explain it to you if you felt like divulging that info...but in 2011, Obamacare saved people nearly 1.5 billion dollars

[David87]

Originally Posted by RyanPm40

I have a PPO with Blue Cross through my father's employer, and all 5 of us in my family have chronic lyme disease and have been under long-term antibiotics and various doctors appointments for years (my sis and I were even on IVs at home for a good while at home). I'd have to ask my dad more specifically what he was referring to, but he said we'll have to spend a hell of a lot more out of pocket than we did before, which is a bummer because its our medical bills that forced us into bankruptcy in the first place. All I know is that it isn't helping us haha

Probably has to do with the fact that he does make a decent salary, it's just our large bills that have been putting us into a lot of debt over the years

hmm...I see.

If there's one thing ObamaCare didn't do, it's address health care costs for those who are sick. It was modeled on the idea of "personal responsibility", a conservative ideal, to be a more "bipartisan effort". Unfortunately, this means that those who get insurance but don't use it get their money back, while those who actually use their insurance won't benefit from the same refunds.

This is pretty much my biggest complaint with the law, and the reason why I think a public option needed to be pushed a hell of a lot more.

[David87]

Originally Posted by RyanPm40

Ahh, alright, that makes a little more sense to me for sure. That's partly why I haven't been a fan of this whole thing.. sure it fixes one problem, but it replaces it with another

I agree somewhat....I don't think ObamaCare creates a new problem...insurance companies were already bleeding sick people for all that they can before hand.

This bill, for whatever reason, didn't try to address that at all...it instead decided to concentrate on addressing the problem of the uninsured, and how we pay for their health care that they currently already get on the taxpayer dime.

Certainly a noble cause to address, but I think many here will tell you that a public option would have addressed both of those problems. From there the problem would be the cost of the program, and if Americans could stop being whiney babies for one second and actually be willing to pay higher taxes to fund a public option. Chances are the 2-3% tax your dad would pay towards a public option would take out less of his income per year than having to pay health insurance premiums/health care costs.


I think it's jawsthemeswimming that pushes the idea that health insurance being a part of our compensation from employers is a big part of what keeps our wages so stagnant, and he's got a good point.

[David87]

Originally Posted by ctmk

you mean not letting people die?

Pretty much.

Right now we provide that care without any means to pay for said care, so it comes out of the general tax funds...the ACA at the very least raises money to help pay for that care through various fines and fees and taxes.